Comments on: Bigotry and sectarianism par excellence http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/ Wed, 20 Aug 2008 17:38:45 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.1 By: Mohamed http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6901 Mohamed Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:01:27 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6901 The Quran tells us everybody is free to believe what he wants, the clerics follow hadiths that nobody really knows where they came from. Muslims should return to the Quran. The Quran tells us everybody is free to believe what he wants, the clerics follow hadiths that nobody really knows where they came from. Muslims should return to the Quran.

]]> By: Nabil http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6554 Nabil Sat, 13 Jan 2007 22:49:19 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6554 I am a Baha'i living in the United States. I was born in Egypt and my birth certificate indicates that my parents religion is Baha'i. I applaud your blog that is aimed at supporting human rights including those of Egyptian Baha'is, and of informing people about the issues and clarifying the issues that the press has muddled related to the Baha'is in Egypt. The Egyptian government MUST not only respect but also protect its minorities rather than attack them by denying their presence and their very existence. When the government itself reneges on its own commitments as a signatory to the United Nations Declaration of Human Rights, and promotes hatred against this small non-political, non-partisan, peace loving community of Baha'is, and when most of the press on this issue toes the government line, what hope is there for ordinary Egyptians to get the true facts! Your work to defend the Baha'is human and civil rights is commendable. You are a ray of hope for understanding, tolerance, and respect of human rights. Egypt must follow the example of developing and developed nations in this regard. India is predominantly Hindu but there lives the largest community of Muslims, and while religious strife may exist, the Indian government grants every citizen their due human rights. Italy and France have many Muslims and while racial prejudice may exist these governments guarantee Muslims identification cards. No country can or should deny the existence of its own citizens because of their conscience, beliefs, creed, or religion. That is official bigotry. And this not only contradicts international treaties, but most importantly it contradicts the compassionate spirit of Islam. The government and the majority of the Egyptian people will eventually see their errant ways and find that their imaginary 'Baha'i' enemy is their truest friend. May your efforts be blessed and bear fruit to shorten the suffering and persecution of this innocent and loving small group of Baha'is for no other reason than their truthfulness and sincerity! I am a Baha’i living in the United States. I was born in Egypt and my birth certificate indicates that my parents religion is Baha’i. I applaud your blog that is aimed at supporting human rights including those of Egyptian Baha’is, and of informing people about the issues and clarifying the issues that the press has muddled related to the Baha’is in Egypt. The Egyptian government MUST not only respect but also protect its minorities rather than attack them by denying their presence and their very existence. When the government itself reneges on its own commitments as a signatory to the United Nations Declaration of Human Rights, and promotes hatred against this small non-political, non-partisan, peace loving community of Baha’is, and when most of the press on this issue toes the government line, what hope is there for ordinary Egyptians to get the true facts! Your work to defend the Baha’is human and civil rights is commendable. You are a ray of hope for understanding, tolerance, and respect of human rights.

Egypt must follow the example of developing and developed nations in this regard. India is predominantly Hindu but there lives the largest community of Muslims, and while religious strife may exist, the Indian government grants every citizen their due human rights. Italy and France have many Muslims and while racial prejudice may exist these governments guarantee Muslims identification cards. No country can or should deny the existence of its own citizens because of their conscience, beliefs, creed, or religion. That is official bigotry. And this not only contradicts international treaties, but most importantly it contradicts the compassionate spirit of Islam.

The government and the majority of the Egyptian people will eventually see their errant ways and find that their imaginary ‘Baha’i’ enemy is their truest friend. May your efforts be blessed and bear fruit to shorten the suffering and persecution of this innocent and loving small group of Baha’is for no other reason than their truthfulness and sincerity!

]]> By: zain http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6296 zain Fri, 05 Jan 2007 14:31:15 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6296 its too sad that egypt cannt accomodate small community. they accept only jews, christians, and muslims as religion. what about hindu, buddist, jains. there is a hindu temple kashi vishvanath, hindu regard it one of the highest pilgramage. that temple official musician was a muslim and he was awarded highest indian national award. he died recently his name was mismillah khan. (can anybody light on shehnai and bismillah khan) i live in india i am muslim a minority community. our president is muslim. we never face such small things. and manipulated drama!! zain from hyderabad its too sad that egypt cannt accomodate small community. they accept only jews, christians, and muslims as religion. what about hindu, buddist, jains. there is a hindu temple kashi vishvanath, hindu regard it one of the highest pilgramage. that temple official musician was a muslim and he was awarded highest indian national award. he died recently his name was mismillah khan. (can anybody light on shehnai and bismillah khan)

i live in india i am muslim a minority community. our president is muslim. we never face such small things. and manipulated drama!!

zain from hyderabad

]]> By: tribe.net: arabist.net http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6284 tribe.net: arabist.net Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:49:40 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6284 <strong>account from those present...</strong> Go here for links/pics: http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-...... account from those present…

Go here for links/pics:
http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-…...

]]> By: Marco Oliveira http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6179 Marco Oliveira Sat, 23 Dec 2006 23:05:33 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6179 Baha’is are responsible for the situation in Lebanon and in Iraq? What else? Are they also responsible for climate changes? And the production delays of the new Airbus A-380? What about acid rains in Europe and America? And those terrible traffic jams in México City, Los Angeles and Paris? The Wall Street Crash of 1929? Some songs of Mariah Carey? The extinction of Dinosaurs? :-) Baha’is are responsible for the situation in Lebanon and in Iraq?

What else? Are they also responsible for climate changes? And the production delays of the new Airbus A-380? What about acid rains in Europe and America? And those terrible traffic jams in México City, Los Angeles and Paris? The Wall Street Crash of 1929? Some songs of Mariah Carey? The extinction of Dinosaurs?

:-)

]]> By: Hossam el-Hamalawy http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6092 Hossam el-Hamalawy Fri, 22 Dec 2006 01:07:05 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6092 Ibn Abdel Aziz, I'm SHOCKED! Al-Masry Al-Youm is going down the drains since Hisham Kassem left.. Ibn Abdel Aziz,
I’m SHOCKED! Al-Masry Al-Youm is going down the drains since Hisham Kassem left..

]]> By: ibn_abdel_aziz http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6062 ibn_abdel_aziz Thu, 21 Dec 2006 19:25:46 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6062 Husam did you see this ? http://justice4every1.blogspot.com/2006/12/blog-post_116672907886849680.html Husam did you see this ?
http://justice4every1.blogspot.com/2006/12/blog-post_116672907886849680.html

]]> By: Bilo http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6025 Bilo Tue, 19 Dec 2006 01:54:14 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6025 Thank you EB, I corrected the blog accordingly...the post was written immediately after the verdict and some of the information had to be re-checked. Thank you EB, I corrected the blog accordingly…the post was written immediately after the verdict and some of the information had to be re-checked.

]]> By: Rancher http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6018 Rancher Mon, 18 Dec 2006 22:08:48 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6018 How soon before they are rounded up and put in camps for the final solution? How soon before they are rounded up and put in camps for the final solution?

]]> By: Egyptian Baha'i http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6009 Egyptian Baha'i Mon, 18 Dec 2006 15:03:59 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6009 I read on Baha'i Faith in Egypt that they are MB. I corrected this information in my reply to the post. According to Hossam Bahgat they aren't. I was there and I didn't really wonder about the affiliation of those men. What I saw from them was beyond any comprehension. I read on Baha’i Faith in Egypt that they are MB. I corrected this information in my reply to the post. According to Hossam Bahgat they aren’t. I was there and I didn’t really wonder about the affiliation of those men. What I saw from them was beyond any comprehension.

]]> By: Mukhtar El Azizi http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6007 Mukhtar El Azizi Mon, 18 Dec 2006 13:38:29 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6007 I just want to say - unfortunately - that all those who denied the Bahais their rights are majority; they are not necessarily Islamists or even practising Islam. In the videos I captured you can listen to ordinary people cursing and argumenting against Bahai's right to write their religion in ID card. http://unbrainwasher.blogspirit.com/archive/2006/12/17/pics-of-bahai-case.html I myself am bearded man. I call myself fundamentalist. Sherief is also a fundamentalist. I believe that the arguments used on that day are false and are fruits of deteriorated educational system plus bad media. thanks! I just want to say - unfortunately - that all those who denied the Bahais their rights are majority; they are not necessarily Islamists or even practising Islam. In the videos I captured you can listen to ordinary people cursing and argumenting against Bahai’s right to write their religion in ID card.

http://unbrainwasher.blogspirit.com/archive/2006/12/17/pics-of-bahai-case.html

I myself am bearded man. I call myself fundamentalist. Sherief is also a fundamentalist.

I believe that the arguments used on that day are false and are fruits of deteriorated educational system plus bad media.

thanks!

]]> By: Daisy http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6002 Daisy Mon, 18 Dec 2006 10:08:43 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-6002 Again, I say, the rule of the law is paramount to this countys progression and betterment. I say scrap the religion slot in the ID cards. Civil society should be governed by law, including marriage, death, birth, inheritance, etc. No more catch-22's - like the grooms not divorcing their wives unless she gives up all her privileges, or even gives him money. Everything governed by a neat and tidy uniformly applied legal (not religious) system. Again, I say, the rule of the law is paramount to this countys progression and betterment. I say scrap the religion slot in the ID cards. Civil society should be governed by law, including marriage, death, birth, inheritance, etc. No more catch-22’s - like the grooms not divorcing their wives unless she gives up all her privileges, or even gives him money. Everything governed by a neat and tidy uniformly applied legal (not religious) system.

]]> By: SP http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5987 SP Sun, 17 Dec 2006 07:46:17 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5987 Amen ya Hossam. I didn't assume the bearded/veiled folks were Islamists necessarily, but I was struck by the irony that the MB's Muhammad Habib when he spoke at AUC a couple of weeks ago was pressed to answer questions on protecting the rights of nonbelievers and Bahais, etc, as a litmus test of whether the Brothers could be trusted to govern (he dodged the question dexterously, by the way) when all along the regime is doing the same damn thing it accuses the Brothers of planning to do. If the problem of sectarianism is as pervasive as you suggest, it's really quite silly for one group to accuse another of being the problem (the state accusing MBs, people accusing the political elite class) but it looks like the issue will keep on being used for political points. Really hope that activism for human rights and civil liberties will eventually increase the space for freedom of conscience. Amen ya Hossam. I didn’t assume the bearded/veiled folks were Islamists necessarily, but I was struck by the irony that the MB’s Muhammad Habib when he spoke at AUC a couple of weeks ago was pressed to answer questions on protecting the rights of nonbelievers and Bahais, etc, as a litmus test of whether the Brothers could be trusted to govern (he dodged the question dexterously, by the way) when all along the regime is doing the same damn thing it accuses the Brothers of planning to do. If the problem of sectarianism is as pervasive as you suggest, it’s really quite silly for one group to accuse another of being the problem (the state accusing MBs, people accusing the political elite class) but it looks like the issue will keep on being used for political points. Really hope that activism for human rights and civil liberties will eventually increase the space for freedom of conscience.

]]> By: Marco Oliveira http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5983 Marco Oliveira Sun, 17 Dec 2006 01:55:38 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5983 A sad day for human rights... a shameful day for Egypt! A sad day for human rights… a shameful day for Egypt!

]]> By: Hossam el-Hamalawy http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5980 Hossam el-Hamalawy Sat, 16 Dec 2006 22:40:28 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5980 SP, I cannot verify that the bearded men and the veiled women I saw slanderring the Bahaai's were members of the Brotherhood. The Bahaai's in Egypt website says they were, but I did not interview them. I just witnessed what they said and did. But that does not mean the MB had taken a sympethatic stand towards the Bahaai's. They did not. The sad fact is, sectarianism is rampant in our society. But that is not a natural law that has to exist and will never change. I totally believe fighting those retarded sectarian ideas is possible... as long as we know its source. It's the ancient trick of divide and rule that our corrupt elites have been playing with for a long time. It's easy and useful for those who run any society to find outcasts and "others" they can blame their troubles on, and give the sense to the rest of the oppressed population that they are superior somehow despite their misery. "We are Muslims at the end of the day," may go the saying here. "We are whites at the end of the day," may go the saying in some Western country despite the PC facade modern capitalism has invented. But if history taught us something, it is people's ideas change when they start challenging the system around them. Openning one door here, can raise questions and uncertainities about mainstream ideas one could have upheld for a long time. I would have loved, if it was up to me, that this "Religion" entry on the ID card would be eliminated. It's retarded and racist idea, and puts you institutionaly within groups you don't choose the minute you are born. But if members of a minority views the move as something crucial for them to get by with their daily lives under the current system, then I'll support their efforts, coz it'll be one step fwd towards improving their conditions. The emancipation of the Egyptian Bahaai's is clearly linked to the emancipation of the rest of the society, even if this society today is sectarian.. this can be changed. SP,
I cannot verify that the bearded men and the veiled women I saw slanderring the Bahaai’s were members of the Brotherhood. The Bahaai’s in Egypt website says they were, but I did not interview them. I just witnessed what they said and did. But that does not mean the MB had taken a sympethatic stand towards the Bahaai’s. They did not.
The sad fact is, sectarianism is rampant in our society. But that is not a natural law that has to exist and will never change. I totally believe fighting those retarded sectarian ideas is possible… as long as we know its source. It’s the ancient trick of divide and rule that our corrupt elites have been playing with for a long time. It’s easy and useful for those who run any society to find outcasts and “others” they can blame their troubles on, and give the sense to the rest of the oppressed population that they are superior somehow despite their misery. “We are Muslims at the end of the day,” may go the saying here. “We are whites at the end of the day,” may go the saying in some Western country despite the PC facade modern capitalism has invented.
But if history taught us something, it is people’s ideas change when they start challenging the system around them. Openning one door here, can raise questions and uncertainities about mainstream ideas one could have upheld for a long time.
I would have loved, if it was up to me, that this “Religion” entry on the ID card would be eliminated. It’s retarded and racist idea, and puts you institutionaly within groups you don’t choose the minute you are born. But if members of a minority views the move as something crucial for them to get by with their daily lives under the current system, then I’ll support their efforts, coz it’ll be one step fwd towards improving their conditions.
The emancipation of the Egyptian Bahaai’s is clearly linked to the emancipation of the rest of the society, even if this society today is sectarian.. this can be changed.

]]> By: Egypeter http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5978 Egypeter Sat, 16 Dec 2006 20:33:30 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5978 Just imagine if you were born a Bahai'i in Egypt. How would you feel about this? Deeply saddens me! Just imagine if you were born a Bahai’i in Egypt. How would you feel about this?

Deeply saddens me!

]]> By: issandr http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5976 issandr Sat, 16 Dec 2006 18:37:29 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5976 Have linked, depressing reminder of the reality of decades of bigotry in education, the media, official religion, etc. Blame the supposedly progressive Free Officers and their successors for that. I hear Omar Suleiman, who hates the MB, is quite bigotted. Have linked, depressing reminder of the reality of decades of bigotry in education, the media, official religion, etc. Blame the supposedly progressive Free Officers and their successors for that. I hear Omar Suleiman, who hates the MB, is quite bigotted.

]]> By: SP http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5975 SP Sat, 16 Dec 2006 18:03:07 +0000 http://arabist.net/arabawy/2006/12/16/anti-bahaais-bigotry-and-sectarianism/#comment-5975 Wow. And people question the Brothers' commitment to citizenship rights for those of different religions or no religion. Do you think enough Egyptians are committed to freedom of conscience for the Bahais to become a sort of cause celebre? Wow. And people question the Brothers’ commitment to citizenship rights for those of different religions or no religion.

Do you think enough Egyptians are committed to freedom of conscience for the Bahais to become a sort of cause celebre?

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