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	<title>Comments on: Liberation through shopping</title>
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	<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 21:22:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Joe</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-353460</link>
		<dc:creator>Joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Apr 2007 16:13:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-353460</guid>
		<description>For what's it's worth, Beacon, dress has nothing to do with sexual harassment. Sexual harassment is about intimidation and instilling fear; what the target is wearing isn't really part of the equation. It can be, but certainly isn't necessary. I don't know any women who haven't been sexually harassed, muhaggaba and otherwise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For what&#8217;s it&#8217;s worth, Beacon, dress has nothing to do with sexual harassment. Sexual harassment is about intimidation and instilling fear; what the target is wearing isn&#8217;t really part of the equation. It can be, but certainly isn&#8217;t necessary. I don&#8217;t know any women who haven&#8217;t been sexually harassed, muhaggaba and otherwise.</p>
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		<title>By: SP</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-353221</link>
		<dc:creator>SP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Apr 2007 08:42:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-353221</guid>
		<description>Beacon, muhaggaba girls were reportedly harrassed during the sexual harrassment fiesta in downtown Cairo at the last Eid. Admittedly, that's more the exception than the rule.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Beacon, muhaggaba girls were reportedly harrassed during the sexual harrassment fiesta in downtown Cairo at the last Eid. Admittedly, that&#8217;s more the exception than the rule.</p>
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		<title>By: Beacon</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-353182</link>
		<dc:creator>Beacon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Apr 2007 02:25:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-353182</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Is there really a link between dressing modestly and not being harassed? Does countries with modestly-dressed women have less crimes committed against women? I have yet to see any link between dress-code and behavior towards women. You need to live in Cairo a bit longerâ€¦ then maybe youâ€™ll see that even the most modestly dressed get harassed.&lt;/i&gt;

I have a hard time believing that. I've lived in Egypt (though largely outside of Cairo), and have never seen modestly-dressed women being sexually harassed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Is there really a link between dressing modestly and not being harassed? Does countries with modestly-dressed women have less crimes committed against women? I have yet to see any link between dress-code and behavior towards women. You need to live in Cairo a bit longerâ€¦ then maybe youâ€™ll see that even the most modestly dressed get harassed.</i></p>
<p>I have a hard time believing that. I&#8217;ve lived in Egypt (though largely outside of Cairo), and have never seen modestly-dressed women being sexually harassed.</p>
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		<title>By: Ms .45</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-353055</link>
		<dc:creator>Ms .45</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Apr 2007 07:09:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-353055</guid>
		<description>"Cosmopolitan cited this as a major â€œfashion donâ€™tâ€ because it was 1) unflattering and 2) not revealing enough for the beach." Bullshit - "burkini's" are very cute! 

I recently attended a presentation by the Islamic Council of Victoria called "My Faith, My Body, My Choice" (or something like that) to get Muslim and non-Muslim women together to explain hijab for the uninitiated, why do we wear it, are we pressured by our husbands/fathers etc. It took the format of a "fashion parade" (our hosts were most keen that it was NOT a fashion parade as such) with pop music, where the volunteers modelled basically their own clothes for different situations, ie uni, work, weddings, etc. They spoke about their reasons for wearing it, acknowledging that it is not going to protect you against rape or assault (there is at least one incident I know of where girls have been raped *because* they were veiled - immediately after 9-11, natch), and also covering the fact that not all Muslim women veil and that this is a "conscience vote" for each Muslim. 

The volunteers and organisers went around and sat at the large tables, the idea being that non-Muslims would be able to meet their first Real Live Muslim and ask unbelievably stupid questions that you'd hopefully be too polite to ask normally. I got lucky because the Real Live Muslim at my table already goes to my uni, so I was able to open a "so, how are you enjoying having working escalators in the Ming Wing" conversation. It was actually pretty enlightening for me - her mum, a white Australian, looked in appearance/dress like a totally conservative hardass, but from what I could hear of the conversation sounded like a genuinely tolerant and open-minded person, not just of Abrahamic religions but of non-monotheistic traditions, which was a real eye-opener for me. 

Another person coped less with the whole thing, abusing an 18 year old woman of Lebanese descent who had decided to veil up a couple of years ago by saying "I'm sorry, I don't accept you as an Australian" (!) and flouncing out of the event! So I guess this is the sort of person who will benefit from puff pieces in the liberal media about Muslim ladies' fashion choices. But yeah, I totally hear you about the vapidity of the fashion-as-freedom agenda. After all, absolutely NO Western women wear high heels or shave their legs because of social pressure. NO THEY DON'T! AND IF YOU QUESTION THIS YOU ARE A TERRORIST!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Cosmopolitan cited this as a major â€œfashion donâ€™tâ€ because it was 1) unflattering and 2) not revealing enough for the beach.&#8221; Bullshit - &#8220;burkini&#8217;s&#8221; are very cute! </p>
<p>I recently attended a presentation by the Islamic Council of Victoria called &#8220;My Faith, My Body, My Choice&#8221; (or something like that) to get Muslim and non-Muslim women together to explain hijab for the uninitiated, why do we wear it, are we pressured by our husbands/fathers etc. It took the format of a &#8220;fashion parade&#8221; (our hosts were most keen that it was NOT a fashion parade as such) with pop music, where the volunteers modelled basically their own clothes for different situations, ie uni, work, weddings, etc. They spoke about their reasons for wearing it, acknowledging that it is not going to protect you against rape or assault (there is at least one incident I know of where girls have been raped *because* they were veiled - immediately after 9-11, natch), and also covering the fact that not all Muslim women veil and that this is a &#8220;conscience vote&#8221; for each Muslim. </p>
<p>The volunteers and organisers went around and sat at the large tables, the idea being that non-Muslims would be able to meet their first Real Live Muslim and ask unbelievably stupid questions that you&#8217;d hopefully be too polite to ask normally. I got lucky because the Real Live Muslim at my table already goes to my uni, so I was able to open a &#8220;so, how are you enjoying having working escalators in the Ming Wing&#8221; conversation. It was actually pretty enlightening for me - her mum, a white Australian, looked in appearance/dress like a totally conservative hardass, but from what I could hear of the conversation sounded like a genuinely tolerant and open-minded person, not just of Abrahamic religions but of non-monotheistic traditions, which was a real eye-opener for me. </p>
<p>Another person coped less with the whole thing, abusing an 18 year old woman of Lebanese descent who had decided to veil up a couple of years ago by saying &#8220;I&#8217;m sorry, I don&#8217;t accept you as an Australian&#8221; (!) and flouncing out of the event! So I guess this is the sort of person who will benefit from puff pieces in the liberal media about Muslim ladies&#8217; fashion choices. But yeah, I totally hear you about the vapidity of the fashion-as-freedom agenda. After all, absolutely NO Western women wear high heels or shave their legs because of social pressure. NO THEY DON&#8217;T! AND IF YOU QUESTION THIS YOU ARE A TERRORIST!!!</p>
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		<title>By: Linda</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352970</link>
		<dc:creator>Linda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Apr 2007 17:57:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352970</guid>
		<description>Is there really a link between dressing modestly and not being harassed? Does countries with modestly-dressed women have less crimes committed against women? I have yet to see any link between dress-code and behavior towards women. You need to live in Cairo a bit longer... then maybe you'll see that even the most modestly dressed get harassed. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Is there really a link between dressing modestly and not being harassed? Does countries with modestly-dressed women have less crimes committed against women? I have yet to see any link between dress-code and behavior towards women. You need to live in Cairo a bit longer&#8230; then maybe you&#8217;ll see that even the most modestly dressed get harassed. <img src='http://www.arabist.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Global Voices Online &#187; Egypt: Muslim Women Fashions</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352948</link>
		<dc:creator>Global Voices Online &#187; Egypt: Muslim Women Fashions</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Apr 2007 14:59:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352948</guid>
		<description>[...] in The Arabist, Ursula Lindsey  discusses her views on an article on the way Muslim women dress up here.    Share [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] in The Arabist, Ursula Lindsey  discusses her views on an article on the way Muslim women dress up here.    Share [...]</p>
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		<title>By: dicemn</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352935</link>
		<dc:creator>dicemn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Apr 2007 12:12:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352935</guid>
		<description>Recently I picked up the latest edition of Cosmopolitan and encountered an article discussing the "anti-fashion" movements taking place throughout the world.  One of them was the invention of the "hijab-kini" a one piece, wet-suit type bathing suit complete with water proof headscarf so Muslim women who observe the hijab can enjoy summer fun in the sun.  The bathing suit is also complete with a skirt and top made of the same bathing suit material to hide the curves of the women who wear it.  Cosmopolitan cited this as a major "fashion don't" because it was 1) unflattering and 2) not revealing enough for the beach.  Unfortunately, this is a common conception in the United States today.  More is less and more is unfashionable.  Reading the New York Times article and your post made me think of this article again.  Not just fashion on the street and in the office, but fashion on the beach is limited for those who decide to dress modestly for their faith.  Once more, that is not oppressive, it is simply a personal choice.  The fact that this is not understood makes me sad.  I am not Muslim but you would not catch me prancing around the beach in a two piece, why is it that more people do not understand that?  Living in Cairo for the past two months has really given me a good perspective on the issue of fashion in Muslim women.  Many decide to wear the headscarf and dress modestly, many do it because it simply makes life easier for them if they do.  Women dressed modestly are less likely to be harassed on the streets.  It is a personal choice just as much as it is a practical choice, which is also not right.  Why are women simply not allowed to decide for themselves how they  want to dress without controversy, New York Times articles, or harassment on the streets?  It should not be a "fashion don't" to wear something more covering then dental floss at the beach.  Just as women should be allowed to decide for themselves if they want to wear a headscarf or not.  Fashion is a personal choice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Recently I picked up the latest edition of Cosmopolitan and encountered an article discussing the &#8220;anti-fashion&#8221; movements taking place throughout the world.  One of them was the invention of the &#8220;hijab-kini&#8221; a one piece, wet-suit type bathing suit complete with water proof headscarf so Muslim women who observe the hijab can enjoy summer fun in the sun.  The bathing suit is also complete with a skirt and top made of the same bathing suit material to hide the curves of the women who wear it.  Cosmopolitan cited this as a major &#8220;fashion don&#8217;t&#8221; because it was 1) unflattering and 2) not revealing enough for the beach.  Unfortunately, this is a common conception in the United States today.  More is less and more is unfashionable.  Reading the New York Times article and your post made me think of this article again.  Not just fashion on the street and in the office, but fashion on the beach is limited for those who decide to dress modestly for their faith.  Once more, that is not oppressive, it is simply a personal choice.  The fact that this is not understood makes me sad.  I am not Muslim but you would not catch me prancing around the beach in a two piece, why is it that more people do not understand that?  Living in Cairo for the past two months has really given me a good perspective on the issue of fashion in Muslim women.  Many decide to wear the headscarf and dress modestly, many do it because it simply makes life easier for them if they do.  Women dressed modestly are less likely to be harassed on the streets.  It is a personal choice just as much as it is a practical choice, which is also not right.  Why are women simply not allowed to decide for themselves how they  want to dress without controversy, New York Times articles, or harassment on the streets?  It should not be a &#8220;fashion don&#8217;t&#8221; to wear something more covering then dental floss at the beach.  Just as women should be allowed to decide for themselves if they want to wear a headscarf or not.  Fashion is a personal choice.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Gara</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352751</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Gara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Apr 2007 08:39:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352751</guid>
		<description>Ursula,

Wouldn't "brash modernity" in clothing mean something fairly obvious to the average person? Revealing, colourful, individualistic, non-conformist, weird...Is that in any way related to traditional Islamic dress?

Re consumerism and self-expression - I agree in the abstract with your idea, but in practice, the same argument could be used for expression through music, art, reading, sports, hobbies.....Sometimes assumptions just deserve to go unquestioned. The problem with this kind of deconstruction is that once you start you cant really stop until you have invalidated everything, everywhere.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ursula,</p>
<p>Wouldn&#8217;t &#8220;brash modernity&#8221; in clothing mean something fairly obvious to the average person? Revealing, colourful, individualistic, non-conformist, weird&#8230;Is that in any way related to traditional Islamic dress?</p>
<p>Re consumerism and self-expression - I agree in the abstract with your idea, but in practice, the same argument could be used for expression through music, art, reading, sports, hobbies&#8230;..Sometimes assumptions just deserve to go unquestioned. The problem with this kind of deconstruction is that once you start you cant really stop until you have invalidated everything, everywhere.</p>
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		<title>By: links for 2007-04-11 &#171; No Snow Here</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352736</link>
		<dc:creator>links for 2007-04-11 &#171; No Snow Here</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Apr 2007 06:29:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352736</guid>
		<description>[...] The Arabist Â» Liberation through shopping via global voices: On a New York Times Article on Muslim women&#8217;s fashion: &#8220;Theresâ€™ no questioning of the assumption that fashion and consumerism do anything but allow the individual woman to express herself.&#8221; (tags: muslimwomen) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] The Arabist Â» Liberation through shopping via global voices: On a New York Times Article on Muslim women&#8217;s fashion: &#8220;Theresâ€™ no questioning of the assumption that fashion and consumerism do anything but allow the individual woman to express herself.&#8221; (tags: muslimwomen) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: ursula</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352440</link>
		<dc:creator>ursula</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Apr 2007 16:11:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352440</guid>
		<description>Hi Tom.

What is "traditional" Islamic dress? The veil? Because the veil that Muslim women wear today in the Middle East and elsewhere is the product of an Islamist revival that is thoroughly modern. It is not--in the way it looks or in what it means--the "traditonal" veil that women wore say 50 or 100 years ago. The very idea of asserting your Muslim identity vis-a-vis the West through the way you dress is also the product of a series of thoroughly modern processes. "Tradition" and "modernity" as Ethan pointed out are artificial categories that we're constantly in the process of making up.

As for deconstructing the New York Times--perhaps you're right and I should spend my time more productively! But I do think that this article is representative of the 
kind of glib generalizations that seem particularly common in discussions of Muslim/Arab issues. I would just like to see coverage that was a bit more original and critical. I don't mean to take this particular reporter or this particular publication too much to task. 

Finally, on the issue of "expressing oneself" through fashion. I'm really not sure how much we express when we buy an item of clothing--our taste, and how well we've responded to a certain advertisement campaign, and how much we want to belong to a certain sub-culture. My point was the unquestioning assumption that buying trendy Western clothes was somehow an act of emancipation--whereas Western feminists, for example, have long criticized the impact of advertising and the commodification of experience and identity.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Tom.</p>
<p>What is &#8220;traditional&#8221; Islamic dress? The veil? Because the veil that Muslim women wear today in the Middle East and elsewhere is the product of an Islamist revival that is thoroughly modern. It is not&#8211;in the way it looks or in what it means&#8211;the &#8220;traditonal&#8221; veil that women wore say 50 or 100 years ago. The very idea of asserting your Muslim identity vis-a-vis the West through the way you dress is also the product of a series of thoroughly modern processes. &#8220;Tradition&#8221; and &#8220;modernity&#8221; as Ethan pointed out are artificial categories that we&#8217;re constantly in the process of making up.</p>
<p>As for deconstructing the New York Times&#8211;perhaps you&#8217;re right and I should spend my time more productively! But I do think that this article is representative of the<br />
kind of glib generalizations that seem particularly common in discussions of Muslim/Arab issues. I would just like to see coverage that was a bit more original and critical. I don&#8217;t mean to take this particular reporter or this particular publication too much to task. </p>
<p>Finally, on the issue of &#8220;expressing oneself&#8221; through fashion. I&#8217;m really not sure how much we express when we buy an item of clothing&#8211;our taste, and how well we&#8217;ve responded to a certain advertisement campaign, and how much we want to belong to a certain sub-culture. My point was the unquestioning assumption that buying trendy Western clothes was somehow an act of emancipation&#8211;whereas Western feminists, for example, have long criticized the impact of advertising and the commodification of experience and identity.</p>
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		<title>By: The Arabist: Identitarian shopping... &#171; Identity Unknown</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352367</link>
		<dc:creator>The Arabist: Identitarian shopping... &#171; Identity Unknown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Apr 2007 14:48:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352367</guid>
		<description>[...] Liberation through shopping [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Liberation through shopping [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Ethan</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352340</link>
		<dc:creator>Ethan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Apr 2007 14:01:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352340</guid>
		<description>Tom, you are buying into the same assumption as the writer that Ursula was trying to problematize: you are assuming that "brash modernity" and Islamic dress are diametrically opposed. I think what she, and many Muslims, would assert is that it's not that simple. And that by assuming that one can't be both "modern" and Muslim you inevitably, perhaps subconsciously in the case of "sympathetic" writers, turn Islam into something necessarily "medieval," "backwards" or "archaic," which in the context of Western cultural imperialism has real significance. Egyptian society today, and arguably since the days of Mohammed Ali and certainly since Nasser, is still wrestling with the Western concepts of "modernity" that assume that modernity and Islam are two different and opposing fields. Thus preventing, say, muhagabba women from appearing in front of a camera on state newscasts for fear of making Egypt appear "backwards." 

Whereas the existence of modern Islamic fashion should force us to question that dichotomy.

I mean, it's not a stretch to say that the fundamental concept here of defining what "modernity" and "Islam" mean in relation to each other is the root conflict that drives al-Qaida and the entire GWOT from both sides. Which is why deconstructing fluff pieces matter.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tom, you are buying into the same assumption as the writer that Ursula was trying to problematize: you are assuming that &#8220;brash modernity&#8221; and Islamic dress are diametrically opposed. I think what she, and many Muslims, would assert is that it&#8217;s not that simple. And that by assuming that one can&#8217;t be both &#8220;modern&#8221; and Muslim you inevitably, perhaps subconsciously in the case of &#8220;sympathetic&#8221; writers, turn Islam into something necessarily &#8220;medieval,&#8221; &#8220;backwards&#8221; or &#8220;archaic,&#8221; which in the context of Western cultural imperialism has real significance. Egyptian society today, and arguably since the days of Mohammed Ali and certainly since Nasser, is still wrestling with the Western concepts of &#8220;modernity&#8221; that assume that modernity and Islam are two different and opposing fields. Thus preventing, say, muhagabba women from appearing in front of a camera on state newscasts for fear of making Egypt appear &#8220;backwards.&#8221; </p>
<p>Whereas the existence of modern Islamic fashion should force us to question that dichotomy.</p>
<p>I mean, it&#8217;s not a stretch to say that the fundamental concept here of defining what &#8220;modernity&#8221; and &#8220;Islam&#8221; mean in relation to each other is the root conflict that drives al-Qaida and the entire GWOT from both sides. Which is why deconstructing fluff pieces matter.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Gara</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352240</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Gara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Apr 2007 12:22:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-352240</guid>
		<description>I don't see the issue here. Traditional Islamic dress would never be associated with "brash modernity" by a Muslim or anybody else, right? So why try and hang some non-existent religious bias onto a writer who was pretty clearly writing a sympathetic piece?

And women do use clothing to express themselves - and most of those clothes get purchased from stores. Women do express themselves through consumerism and fashion.

It's a fluff piece on hip urban muslims trying to look cool while staying halal - why read into it 5 layers deep to discover some orientalist capitalist sub plot?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see the issue here. Traditional Islamic dress would never be associated with &#8220;brash modernity&#8221; by a Muslim or anybody else, right? So why try and hang some non-existent religious bias onto a writer who was pretty clearly writing a sympathetic piece?</p>
<p>And women do use clothing to express themselves - and most of those clothes get purchased from stores. Women do express themselves through consumerism and fashion.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a fluff piece on hip urban muslims trying to look cool while staying halal - why read into it 5 layers deep to discover some orientalist capitalist sub plot?</p>
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		<title>By: SP</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-351510</link>
		<dc:creator>SP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Apr 2007 13:44:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-351510</guid>
		<description>PH - absolutely right re: the different reasons why women wear hijab, sometimes you can just see young women in Cairo pushing the limits, with the calf-length skirts and boots and tighter clothes, and there's no reason to believe that many of these muhaggabat are doing it out of piety or a desire to be modest. There doesn't seem to be anything self-conscious about it, and it's probably just the new-veilers (Amr Khaled influenced or otherwise) and the Islamist halaqat crowd who see the veil as a religious or political statement any more. Even among the elite Amr Khaled types you get the sense that it's more about the "look" now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PH - absolutely right re: the different reasons why women wear hijab, sometimes you can just see young women in Cairo pushing the limits, with the calf-length skirts and boots and tighter clothes, and there&#8217;s no reason to believe that many of these muhaggabat are doing it out of piety or a desire to be modest. There doesn&#8217;t seem to be anything self-conscious about it, and it&#8217;s probably just the new-veilers (Amr Khaled influenced or otherwise) and the Islamist halaqat crowd who see the veil as a religious or political statement any more. Even among the elite Amr Khaled types you get the sense that it&#8217;s more about the &#8220;look&#8221; now.</p>
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		<title>By: PH</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-351474</link>
		<dc:creator>PH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Apr 2007 13:19:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-351474</guid>
		<description>This might seem like an obvious point, but in response to SP's comment:  I think the boddy-hugging fashions we see in Cairo, worn by the Cairene muhaggibat simply indicate that many of these women are not observing higab out of a genuine desire for modesty, but for a variety of other reasons (its now the thing to do, family pressure, compromise, etc).  Generally, when the pressure to observe hijab is imposed externally (whether by a regime, or by one's family), women may find ways to observe it in its loosest sense (such as women in Iran, particularly Tehran, who barely throw a loose scarf on their heads while caking their faces with make-up).  This is probably why the decision should be up to each individual woman.  The only thing I sort of appreciated about the article (though the point was never explicitly made) was the fact that non-muhagabba women were interviewed, who also discussed modesty, because there are many ways to be modest other than throwing a piece of cloth on your head.  The dignity and pride with which a woman carries herself says infinitely more about her sense of self than what she wears.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This might seem like an obvious point, but in response to SP&#8217;s comment:  I think the boddy-hugging fashions we see in Cairo, worn by the Cairene muhaggibat simply indicate that many of these women are not observing higab out of a genuine desire for modesty, but for a variety of other reasons (its now the thing to do, family pressure, compromise, etc).  Generally, when the pressure to observe hijab is imposed externally (whether by a regime, or by one&#8217;s family), women may find ways to observe it in its loosest sense (such as women in Iran, particularly Tehran, who barely throw a loose scarf on their heads while caking their faces with make-up).  This is probably why the decision should be up to each individual woman.  The only thing I sort of appreciated about the article (though the point was never explicitly made) was the fact that non-muhagabba women were interviewed, who also discussed modesty, because there are many ways to be modest other than throwing a piece of cloth on your head.  The dignity and pride with which a woman carries herself says infinitely more about her sense of self than what she wears.</p>
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		<title>By: Global Voices Online &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Egypt: The NYT Discovers Muslim Fashion</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-350636</link>
		<dc:creator>Global Voices Online &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Egypt: The NYT Discovers Muslim Fashion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Apr 2007 16:42:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-350636</guid>
		<description>[...] Times in which the &#8220;trials&#8221; of being fashionable and a Muslim woman are illustrated:&#8221; Ever since I read this New York Times article a few days back about the identitarian fashion...    Deborah Ann [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Times in which the &#8220;trials&#8221; of being fashionable and a Muslim woman are illustrated:&#8221; Ever since I read this New York Times article a few days back about the identitarian fashion&#8230;    Deborah Ann [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Ibn Bint Jbeil</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-350439</link>
		<dc:creator>Ibn Bint Jbeil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Apr 2007 13:24:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-350439</guid>
		<description>Enjoyed reading your writing.  Thoughtful &#38; Provocative.  Makes me proud that Muslims or Arabs such as yourself speak from a point of view of pride, rather than humility to other people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Enjoyed reading your writing.  Thoughtful &amp; Provocative.  Makes me proud that Muslims or Arabs such as yourself speak from a point of view of pride, rather than humility to other people.</p>
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		<title>By: Again, with the othering &#171; Alif Sikkiin</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-350435</link>
		<dc:creator>Again, with the othering &#171; Alif Sikkiin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Apr 2007 13:23:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-350435</guid>
		<description>[...] 8th, 2007 &#183; No Comments  Ursula Lindsey has a very interesting post on her reaction to this New York Times story on Muslim women who wear the hijab as well as [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] 8th, 2007 &middot; No Comments  Ursula Lindsey has a very interesting post on her reaction to this New York Times story on Muslim women who wear the hijab as well as [...]</p>
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		<title>By: SP</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-350196</link>
		<dc:creator>SP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Apr 2007 10:49:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-350196</guid>
		<description>Your points are all excellent ones, but I was still intrigued by the fact that the women interviewed referred to muhagappropriate clothes as "sister-friendly" items - definitely some American-style identity politics going on there. 

It's surprising that Asra Nomani shows up in this article as she's not veiled and actually makes a point of protesting the assumption that Muslim = veiled. Also kind of funny that these American Muslim women are looking for clothes that will hide their curves while their counterparts in Cairo are wearing super-tight tops and pants with high heeled boots along with their colour-coordinated hijabs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your points are all excellent ones, but I was still intrigued by the fact that the women interviewed referred to muhagappropriate clothes as &#8220;sister-friendly&#8221; items - definitely some American-style identity politics going on there. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s surprising that Asra Nomani shows up in this article as she&#8217;s not veiled and actually makes a point of protesting the assumption that Muslim = veiled. Also kind of funny that these American Muslim women are looking for clothes that will hide their curves while their counterparts in Cairo are wearing super-tight tops and pants with high heeled boots along with their colour-coordinated hijabs.</p>
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		<title>By: PH</title>
		<link>http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-349971</link>
		<dc:creator>PH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Apr 2007 07:48:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://arabist.net/archives/2007/04/08/liberation-through-shopping/#comment-349971</guid>
		<description>Tell me about it!  The Prada satin turban?  an Ungaro blouse?  Actually, the other night strolling through a somewhat high-end mall in Cairo where many of the mannequins in the windows displayed "hip" hijab fashions, it occurred to me just how much more money a woman has to spend to observe hijab &#38; be considered fashionable.  For instance, a short-sleeved baby doll dress has to be paired up with another shirt, and worn over a pair of jeans, and then there's all the accessorizing - like two different color scarves worn together for contrast, etc...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tell me about it!  The Prada satin turban?  an Ungaro blouse?  Actually, the other night strolling through a somewhat high-end mall in Cairo where many of the mannequins in the windows displayed &#8220;hip&#8221; hijab fashions, it occurred to me just how much more money a woman has to spend to observe hijab &amp; be considered fashionable.  For instance, a short-sleeved baby doll dress has to be paired up with another shirt, and worn over a pair of jeans, and then there&#8217;s all the accessorizing - like two different color scarves worn together for contrast, etc&#8230;</p>
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